Sony Patents Possible PS5 Backward Compatibility Method Invented by Mark Cerny

The house of PlayStation, Sony Interactive Entertainment, registered a patent with the Japan Patent Office which seems to have "PS5" written all over it.

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Please be true

[WANNAGETHIGH]

We really need BC, I mean how can PS2 support it but his big brothers dose not? Crazy ain’t it. You will think with tech cheaper to make now than it was 20 years ago that BC will be the norm for both Sony and Microsoft.

[Zeref]

It already is the norm for Microsoft.

Every Xbox console has had Backwards compatibility.

[IRetrouk]

Limited emulation, not bc, I can't play any of my pgrs, full bc was on ps2 and the more expensive 60g ps3, both 360 and the one use emulation, its not the same thing, each game has to be reworked before working.

[Teflon02]

Zeref
Thought Zeref was smarter than that. *FAIRY TAIL EP 290 SPOILER*
Then again you ruined Mavis' life and then ended it so I don't have kind words for you

Foreal though, PS2 didn't use emulation. PSOne didn't require anything special to run on PS2. But SOny used the Emotion Engine for PS2. It's not the typical setup meaning for a game to run on hardware that doesn't have the Emotion built in. It required the game being emulated while being modified by the emulation process to run properly. The exact same case for the PS3 where they used the Cell. Maybe wondering why they did. They both proved to have hidden potential that pushed past what a similar setup could do otherwise but required more work to get going. It's why some PS2 and PS3 games don't run as good as the X360, NGC and XBox. They weren't simple port jobs. It's also why PS3 games that weren't made on PS3 and ported out to other consoles were usually a pretty decent downgrade but when you did them on PS3 first they were usually above standard. PS5 will lively Run PS3 titles like PS4 runs PS2 and so on. Next gen everything should overall run on one console. But even PC can't run every old PC game without modifications and tweaks as somethings were made to specifically take advantage of just the exact hardware of the time of creation etc

[Obscure_Observer]

@IRetrouk

"Limited emulation, not bc"

Well, hopefully Sony will achieve native BC. Otherwise, is gonna be very funny to see you people referring to PS5´s BC as "Limited Emulation". ;)

[TKCMuzzer]

Er, because the PS2 had the hardware to run PS1 games as did the PS3 60GB. They have to use emulation these days to keep the costs down and that alone brings its own technical issues.

[remixx116]

@obscure

Why is it funny to you? Why the winky face? Are you that much of a fanboy that it makes you feel good? He was just pointing out a flaw in Zerefs statement.

You people are weird and get pleasure from the oddest shit.

[Zenbaby369]

@Teflon02 Correct me if I'm wrong, but because ps3 was with the cell processors, the idea of BC on ps5 is a fairy tale right? It would literally HAVE to be emulation unless they decided to go back to the cell processors for ps5 "which they won't obviously". They just simply don't work the same right?

[WelkinCole]

For PS3 it had at the start but it was too expensive for games that they didn't care.

For PS4 the PS3 architecture also means that they would have to baiscally do another mini PS3 inside the PS4

PS5 though I am pretty sure they will go software instead of hardware which would be significantly cheaper to have PS4 BC. I am sure it will have PS4 BC in there

[XiNatsuDragnel]

Nii san @Spoiler you're not alone I'm worried about you as family.

Forreal though dude chill on the Ps hate train

[IRetrouk]

Obscure, if that's what it is when it comes out that's what I will call it..... Don't really see the point you are trying to make to be honest, what I said is true.

[Bronxs15]

wow what biased goggles some ppl have. saying ps2/3 back compat was better than xbox one's because xbox one uses emulation. do you all realize that the emulation improves the game? put a ps2 game in a ps3 it plays the same as it did on ps2. put some xbox 360 games like orange box or red dead redemption in xbox one and they play in 4k! not to mention faster loading, better frames etc...you can keep your ps2 hardware emulation!

[IRetrouk]

Nobody said one way was better than the other, just that the xbox does not offer full bc, but limited emulation, which is what it is, the ps2 and original 60g ps3 were full bc machines, there is a difference, I just pointed it out.

[IMissJimRyan]

The concept of BC is obsolete. Every major game company works now with the idea of platform like Android and iOS have stabilished. I thought PlayStation 4 Pro and Xbox One X had make it clear.

Sony won't show PS5 as a BC console, but as a newer hardware for PlayStation owners. It'll have software that PS4 ans PS4 Pro can't handle, of course, but forget the idea of BC.

[Eonjay]

How many hints can they give? It will be BC.

[Sieden]

How do you exist?

[IMissJimRyan]

People think I'm saying PS5 won't be compatible with PS4 games. It will. But the idea is different from BC from PS1 to PS2.

The compatibility will be similar to Android devices or Windows where you have an ecosystem. Newer hardware will support legacy software by default and not by BC. They want you to carry your PSN account over, and keep buying old games.

[Abriael]

Actually Locomorales is likely right. If PS5 and PS4 have exactly the same architecture, just with different power, and honestly, why wouldn't they? It's the simplest and most basic you can get.

In that case, you don't NEED backward compatibility. You can simply run PS4 games natively like you can easily run most windows 7 games on windows 10. The only issue would be tricking the game's security system to believe that it's being run by a PS4, otherwise it won't run.

And this is exactly what this patent addresses.

The PS4 is basically a PC. The PS5 is basically going to be a more powerful PC. What "compatibility" do you need besides telling the game "hey, don't worry, I'm a PS4, I can run you"?

Compatibility is nice, but the ability to run the games natively makes it obsolete.

[GamerFrank85]

Lol okay.

[Eonjay]

I see what you are saying but I encourage you to actually read the patent and description of the process being patented. It suggests that even though the newer hardware is capable of running legacy software, it is sometime more appropriate to have a method for customizing the process of the CPU so that you can avoid timing issues. It sounds like hardware level emulation of a legacy CPU.

[Abriael]

@Eonjay: I have, but that sounds more like an issue solver comparable to compatibility mode in windows, and not a standard procedure. You use it only when you need it, not all the time.

My prediction is that games will run natively most of the time, without need of any help besides tricking them into believing they're running on PS4, with some compatibility workarounds in case of specific issues.

[notachance]

I've said this time and time again and I'm gonna repeat it: in the future console games will have minimum and recommended requirement instead of completely separated by generation, eg. minimum PS4Pro & XB1X, recommended PS5 & XB2

like how software in PC and smartphone is right now.

[Markusb33]

That makes no sense or logic at all.
The idea of cross platform games is very pro consumer and a way to shift ps4 users to ps5. Taking your library physical or digital is a big bonus on any platform

[Obscure_Observer]

Let´s see if they can achieve NATIVE backwards compatibility for all games!

[Eonjay]

It seems to be where they are going. Obviously this point to hardware level support.

[Razzer]

lol....why wouldn't it be native? It is still AMD architecture. For all games or for all PS4 games? Because "native' BC isn't possible for all PlayStation games without embedding the actual hardware. You do realize that Xbox One does not have "native" BC....right?

[Silly gameAr]

Like they did for PS2 and PS3?

[rainslacker]

I like how yesterday you were using the question of bc to say why Sony is behind, and is the one that needs to catch up, and today, you're questioning if it will be native bc. Is that going to be the new thing for you to bring Sony down.

Just curious, because it gets hard to keep up with what matters to you, so I like to stay ahead of the game.

[UltraNova]

Rain,

He's just salty that Sony just keeps ticking boxes...

[Obscure_Observer]

@rainslacker

"I like how yesterday you were using the question of bc to say why Sony is behind, and is the one that needs to catch up, and today, you're questioning if it will be native bc. Is that going to be the new thing for you to bring Sony down."

To me, BC is a GREAT selling point. To you, (and some of your peers) it´s just a "nice feature to have". So, since you already said that you don´t care about BC, i´m gonna answer to your question out of respect, because i you clearly failed to notice the sarcasm on my statement. I was just making fun out of fanboys whose used to brag about Sony´s native BC on a few PS3 consoles while referring to Xbox One´s BC as "Limited emulation, not bc". READ my original post.

That said, i´m completely aware that it´s IMPOSSIBLE to make PS5 consoles that features native backwards compatibility with all of the Playstation family consoles, without a massive impact on the console´s final price. Price, was one of the reasons that made Sony drop BC support on PS3.

You see, nobody wants to bring Sony down because BC or the lack of it. That´s your obssesion and paranoia about everyone who´s make any criticism regarding Sony taking the best of you. I want Playstation to be better. If they will follow/copy Microsoft or Nintendo on whatever they´re doing, it´s fine by me. More the merrier. They already allowed downloadable PS4 games following Game Pass. I think they will make new Playstation games avaliable on PS Now, soon. And i know that you gonna be pissed the momment people start to thank Phil Spencer for making PS Now better. Because that´s part of your childsh/ungrateful nature.

[SuperSonic91]

"Its all part of the plan".

[Fil101]

I might be wrong but as soon as they announced that ps+ online storage was being bumped up to a whopping 100 G. The first thing I thought was that ps5 has to be backwards compatible it makes a lot of sense and I’ll bet a lot of people have already come to this conclusion.

[UnholyLight]

I sure hope so this would be so awesome!

[Bronxs15]

if this happens backward compatibility will now become the best thing since slice bread for all ps fanboys. despite them all downplaying back compat on xbox one now lol

[mkis007]

For the start of a new generation it is ideal. 3 years in is kinda too late to really mean the same thing.

[DaGR8JIBRALTAR]

It has to have this feature..please Sony don't be stupid.

[WANNAGETHIGH]

I don’t know why people are disagreeing with you. I can’t count the amount of time I booted on my og ps3 just so I could play Kz2. Would be much nicer if I could just insert the CD in my PS4.

[dumahim]

Because it doesn't need the feature. There's a lot of people who don't care about BC.

edit: As evidence, look how well PS4 did without BC.

[ABizzel1]

@dumahim

That's because neither console had BC at launch. It's not a huge feature / benefit 3+ years into a consoles lifecycle, since only a select few games from last-gen are likely to be played by gamers, but it is a VERY strong selling point, and a way to ease gamers into upgrading to the successor of the console they already have if their current game library can be played on the new console.

It allows gamers to sell their current console to help ease the cost of the new +$400 machine, and allows them to have games to play during the inevitable Year 1 drought.

So it's important to an extent, and it's important for simply having a complete library of games, it's just not a huge benefit 3 years down the road.

[WelkinCole]

Yeah its more of a convenience thing than a must have.

But PS5 games and price is top priority.

If Sony manages to do a software BC that would not increase the price much then that would be ok as well

[dumahim]

@ABizzel1

It's important for people who care about BC, but it seems a lot of people seem to keep ignoring that there's a lot of people who don't care. It wasn't a "needed" feature then, it isn't a "needed" feature the next time around either.

[ABizzel1]

@dumahim

It's just a matter of catering to the largest possible group to maximize sales. There people who don't care simply won't use it, but not having it prevents the people who do care from bringing their library over and run the risk of losing that market at launch or worse to the competitor.

[OffRoadKing]

It doesn't have to. The majority of Playstation gamers buy new hardware to play new games. Couldn't care less rather it has it or not, the only upside will be that hopefully it will finally shut people up.

[starchild]

Well, at least you're being consistent. Can't say the same for most of these hypocrites.

But I strongly disagree with you. I care a lot about backwards compatibility. It's one of the things that draws me to the PC and makes it my main gaming platform. If the PS5 does offer backwards compatibility it will be one large step towards making me interested in using it for more than just the occasional exclusive.

I'm glad Sony doesn't listen to the extremists trying to downplay backwards compatibility. They know that people like that are a tiny fraction of the PS4 userbase and don't represent normal gamers that buy their platforms.

[BizarroUltraman]

That could be said for all gamers. The buy the new stuffand Xbox has always had a good attachment rate.

You douches say you don't like yet go on forums and you're begging for it. Lol...

[OffRoadKing]

@starchild

You're right Sony doesn't listen to the extremists that's why they dont do BC. People trying to play it up are a tiny fraction of the user base and dont represent normal gamers that want new gaming experiences. The other larger portion of those playing it up are xbot fanboys using it as an excuse to troll and attack Sony.

[sampsonon]

if i have a choice between them using their resources on BC or brand new AAA games, ditch the BC please. it's not that important.

[Mr_Writer85]

What? Why can't they do both? The people behind the hardware and the OS side of things are not the ones making games.

What a silly thing to say.

[kayoss]

@Mr_Writer
You cant do both if the PS4 and Xbox One didnt come with BC capability out of the gate. Microsoft decided to add BC capability to the xbox one after the release of the console. This take resources and development time. This is why people are bashing Microsoft. They put so much resources on BC for the xbox one and neglected AAA exclusive games. They deserves all the ridicule for not prioritizing whats more important to fans.

[sampsonon]

@Mr_Writer85: ask MS why. it all costs money, and they have a budget. you can't be that naive?

[sampsonon]

@shaggy2303: "You think it's one or the other? You think the team that works on BC also develops games?"
it's about resources. companies set a budget and then decide where the money will be used.
so making a game BC costs money, cheaper than making a new IP, so that costs cuts into the overall budget for the division.

i thought people understood the basics.

[starchild]

No, kayoss, that's dumb. Microsoft should be criticised for slacking on exclusives, but they should be praised for backwards compatibility. They have plenty of money to do both. It was simply poor business decisions they made.

That doesn't mean you turn around and start downplaying backwards compatibility itself.

[Mr_Writer85]

@kayoss

You literally just posted drivel.

MS adding BC to the X1 has nothing to do with 1st party studios making games, the fact that MS are adding more games to X1 and buying new studios to make more exclusives proves this.

The developers behind the Xbox features are separate from the developers of games.

[porkChop]

So the CPU would essentially receive a call/order and then emulate a specified older CPU to provide BC. That likely wouldn't be necessary for PS4 games as it would be the same architecture. This could be used to emulate the Cell though, providing PS3 BC. Now that would be great to see.

[IRetrouk]

Has to be ps3, all rumors point to Sony sticking with amd, which obvs makes sense, so like you say, the cpu won't be all that diff, hopefully that means the ps2s emotion engine can be done too, getting ahead of myself though, I would be happy with ps4 bc, anything else will be a bonus.

[Dark_Knightmare2]

Yeah as long as I can carry my PS4 collection over I’ll be one happy camper

[MajorLazer]

PS3 emulation would be heaven

[Saigon]

@L7CHAPEL

Based on the description applied in this article and what @porkChop stated, it looks like they may have solved the PS3 issue. There are a lot of rumors on the net that state the new PS5 chip-set is powerful enough to emulate the the PS3 but this article looks like Sony is taking it a step further.

[Razzer]

I don't know. It is talking about one CPU "impersonating" another. That sounds like PS5 to PS4 BC more than anything else. There is no way to "impersonate" the Cell processor. You've got to emulate it in software.

[rainslacker]

Emulators just translate code, but more so, handle the output and input from the software. This patent doesn't seem to translate in the same way. Plus, it seems more versatile from a support perspective.

[Mr_Writer85]

IF the PS5 has PS1-4 BC then that's a huge win for Sony.

I for one would smack down even £600 for it.

[Zeref]

Xbox does this already at no extra cost.

[The Wood]

Yes zeref it did do it eventually and what does 'no extra cost' mean? Are Sony in the habit of fleecing their customers or something?

If they implement this correctly the next console will fly off the shelves quicker than they did this gen which would be a kick in the teeth for the next box if they launch around the same time again. Just look at the back catalogue ps guys have to choose from compared to the Xbox one. Hopefully enhanced too so where MS done well with bc Sony smashed em to bits with current games which makes their bc more of a pull because of quality available

[mkis007]

Zeref stop stretching the truth. The games are reworked to be compatible with xbox1 they do not offer full bc. can't pop in all my games they aren't all compatible.

There has not been a full bc console since the OG ps3 which could play ps1-ps3 100% no updates required.

[Mr_Writer85]

@zeref

When did Xbox start having PS1-4 games?

[Mr_Writer85]

@shaggy

I think he means with more than 1 gen.

The PS3 was the only console that could play any game released on any home console PlayStation.

The WiiU for example couldn't play physical NES or Snes games for example.

[Melankolis]

@Zeref
True. I appreciate Xbox to have done BC. Be it a main feature (because of lacks of exclusive games) or a complementary for XBO i still appreciate it.

But i think Mr_Writer originally meant is that the games library PS1 to PS4 are soooo huge. Not only huge, but also high quality. That he would even better pay £600 than getting Xbox BC for free!.

So comparing Playstation BC with Xbox BC, the real question might be "how much will we get"? rather than "how much it cost?"

[Teflon02]

I swear if they brought out a Ultimate version of the PS5 with the Emotion and Cell built in at a premium and it uses the extra power to upgrade the games to 4K. I would easily pay a serious premium for it. I know it probably wouldn't be the popular version of the console. But I think the hardcore would buy it out crazy fast. PS4 running on PS5 will be as simple as me starting a PS3 gen game on steam with my GTX 1080 and running at 4K lol.
Wishful thinking but it would be awesome.

[Mr_Writer85]

@shaggy

I know you're being sarcastic with the wisdom comment, but it helped cut the cost of the console, which meant they could cut the price and helped them to cut a huge chunk out of the 360s market share.

I don't need to find one as I do have one, but £90 isn't that bad.

https://uk.webuy.com/produc...

[rainslacker]

I would love it if they do that, as if like to retire my ps3. Only real concern I have though is they may opt to.not support cd media again, which cuts out physical ps1 games, and some ps2 games. But if they include that, which seems reasonable since UHD lasers do support cd format without any added cost, or at least not much, then, yeah, it would probably be hard to resist for anyone who has older games, or an extensive back catalog. If one has had ps+ and added all those ps1 games, then they'd have hundreds of games out of the box.

Plus, it would shut some people up that need to have a way to make something look bad.

Cherry on the top would be if it has a good way to upgrade those games while playing with no extra work from the dev....may be coupled with added trophy support, which would likely cost money.

[ludicrous]

@writer

So I'm wondering if ms made Xbox able to play all window games (new and old), as well as all Xbox games? It is not so hard to see that Xbox are transitioning toward more like a unified window platform. Which would have more games content if that happen?

Though maybe not all pc games, cause last time i tried to play old pc games like quest for glory, the game ran too fast and i can't play it (where as I used to have to lower graphic setting to have decent frame rate lol), time passes by so quickly.

[elazz]

You don't need Mark Cerny for any other emulation besides PS3 to be honest. Ps2 and ps1 is fairly simple on x86 hardware and the ps5 is very similar architecture. Only ps3 would be a challenge for him to take on.

[rainslacker]

This technique would work for any emulation, although I agree it's probably aimed more at ps3 emulation.

[rainslacker]

The patent actually seems more relevant to non-x86 processors, because there is no reason for this on an x86 processor as they use the same function calls. X86 is always built from the prior versions,all the way back to the first 8086. Only things that get emulated are 8, 16, or 32 but code on processors with higher but ratings.

If I'm reading the patent right, this is a different kind of emulation, which instead of having specific functions to emulate process calls built into the use program, it runs the software as normal, and the code is changed before sending it to the processor, and then instead of interpreting the results for the program, it changes then back to the expected result for the program. I know it sounds like the same thing, but it's functionally different.

It means that emulation is more fluid, and individual programs will work almost without fail, instead of maintaining a database of special processes that may have been implemented, but aren't handled by the system. It also means the emulation program can be a single program, instead of different emulators.

But, with the recent rumors of the ps5 clock speed for the processor, it means ps3 emulation could be a lot easier to enable. Ps1/2 should also work on this principal, and of course Sony could opt to extend its trophy additions to those games, which some publishers may like. That May be wishful thinking, but I think there are pubs out there who wouldn't mind making money off a trophy patch for older games.

[Soap_Z]

Cannot wait to play Demon's Souls on PS5

So many PS3 games deserves more love

[xX-oldboy-Xx]

I'm hoping they close the PS5 reveal with a Demons Souls 2 announcement, a stretch I know. But one can dream.

[Father__Merrin]

Demon souls 2 as a launch game.....

[MajorLazer]

If they announced Demon's Souls 2, I would probably keel over and die due to sheer joy and elation. My absolute favourite game of last gen, BB my favourite of this gen. Currently playing, and utterly loving Dark Souls 3. Sekiro not too far away and that I can tell is going to be another masterpiece.

[sinspirit]

That would be fantastic. I'm sure we'll have Demons Souls 2 eventually. I have been hoping for a Demons Souls 1 remaster/remake with extra content(the broken stone in the Nexus could be fixed and be a new area for instance).

[TheGamez100]

MAG....man I loved that game. Also want to finish ni no kuni and white knight chronicles 2. I just cant go back to 720p gaming....

[sinspirit]

MAG was very underrated. Very accurate weapon fire unlike many shooters at the time(and even now) that have peer to peer host advantage. Also gave a lot of freedom of how to approach your goal and the skill tree was really nice to have and gave a nice sense of progression rather than simply unlocking weapons as you go like everything else. I'm surprised these shooters with RPG elements these days don't have a skill tree like this.

[jznrpg]

I’m in I still have my copy

[mt]

please be true for both Disc and downloaded games..

[zahdab]

i'll try my best

[JackBNimble]

Of course it would be true for both disc and digital, why wouldn't it be?

[Pyrofire95]

I don't see why Xbox or PS4 wouldn't be BC, they are both just computers with a custom OS at this point. It's not too much of a step further than the X and Pro models. I think this generation had "future backwards" compatibility in mind, but also just as side effect of the systems (Xbox, PS, PC) being similar and making multi platform development easier.

I will amend that X and Pro have the same architecture but a new gen would have a different one causing some possible incompatibility.

[MeteorPanda]

please. otherwise l'm not even interested. lm not buying all my games again ffs

[Ristul]

You could just keep your old consoles though, no one is forcing you to buy games again. With that said, I too hope it has bc.

[MeteorPanda]

while true. l am not going to hook up every console l own to the tv and l dont like swapping out hdmi cables.

bc shouldnt be an issue with the ps2 and 4, it was 3 that was an awkward monster to emulate.

[Elda]

True I own the Pro & the slim PS3.

[starchild]

I'm sorry, but I hate this response... "Just keep your old consoles."

Most people don't want to have to keep a bunch of consoles hooked up. Old consoles also eventually die and that's just another expense to worry about. And over time those consoles may get hard to find. Finally, it ignores the fact that one thing that's really nice about backwards compatibility is the potential to run your games with better visuals and framerates.

Saying "just keep your old consoles" sounds as ridiculous to me as if someone said "don't be mad they took the GPS and flashlight feature out of the newest phone just carry around a real flashlight and standalone GPS unit".

People love convenience and convergence.

[OffRoadKing]

lol, seriously how old is your TV any TV made in the last decade has had more than one HDMI connection. FYI they have splitters on the market. If you dont want to buy one well hey that's your loss, but something tells me you probably really weren't that interested in the first place.

[gangsta_red]

I love how people on this site spend more time telling others how much a group isn't interested in something more than anything else.

Maybe he wants the convieniance of not having 4-5 consoles all wired up and hooked up to a TV, maybe he just doesn't have the space for all that.

Maybe PS5 should just be BC with PS4 games instead of coming up with other wild excuses of it with the slim chance of not being.

[rainslacker]

My bigger problem is finding tvs or receivers which have enough analog inputs for older systems. Used to have one with 12 inputs, but with HDMI one or two is more common. Most tvs don't have analog inputs anymore.

I have two switched which output through HDMI now, and they both have remotes.

But i have a lot of systems hooked up, and I'm not the norm, even among collectors and retro gamers.

While I'm fine with having everything hooked up, I will.still opt to have one console that can.perform double or triple duty.

[MeteorPanda]

the fuck? its called my tv still works, it's old but no reason enough to buy another one. my loss cause my tv still works? do you read what you write?

[OffRoadKing]

Your loss if you dont get a PS5, I think its you that's having trouble with reading comprehension.

[MeteorPanda]

something tells you l'm not interested you say?

"please. otherwise l'm not even interested" - meteorpanda

goddamn, you're gonna need a Ted talk to explain how you cracked this one, sir.

[OffRoadKing]

The point was if you need it to have BC in order to buy one you were never really interested in the first place. You can save the Ted talks for yourself.

[MeteorPanda]

ofc l'll not be interested straight away. not until the ps5 has a library worth spending the easy 1k console/games for, that wont happen until another 6 months after launch.

Just cause l'm not fanboying all over the thing that has not even been shown yet does not make me not have interest. I'm an adult, l dont have to show every emotion in extremes.

[brich233]

If PS5 has full backwards compatibility with 3 and 4, i will defintely get it, So many PS4 games I have yet to play, and thier are some ps3 games also.

[Eidolon]

PS3 BC probably won't happen. But PS4 I think is a fore sure thing.

[brich233]

Ps3 has been making its way to pc gaming, look it up. search "RPCS3"

[AK91]

CMON CERNY COME ON THROUGH

[mkis007]

I just dont want infamous 1 and 2 and killzone 2 and 3 to be lost to the pre-1080p era. I would kill for a remaster of those 2. ps3 gen was so awkward looking back. infamous 1 doesnt hold up very well and I would go bananas for it with the fidelity of ISS.

[PhoenixUp]

Funny how people’s attitudes towards backwards compatibility can be shifted by whatever Sony’s stance on it is at the time.

With PS2 & PS3 initially people rightfully praised backwards compatibility. Yet with PS3 in its later years and PS4 people acted like couldn’t care less about the feature as whole. It’d be funny if PS5 did get backwards compatibility and those same people started praising the feature.

[boing1]

I don't care about BC but it's so obvious PS5 is gonna have it that it hurts.

[OffRoadKing]

Whats funny is that the people who seem to make the biggest deal about it are the people who don't own Playstation and never will.

[Saigon]

I don't really care for BC. I only like it during the first year of the generation. After that it is barley used. If you are trying to compare it to the MS BC, that is a whole other story. MS BC was suppose to be a system seller, it wasn't. MS BC was suppose to be a game changer, it wasn't. MS BC is a standard emulation and not a true BC. Sony BC is a true BC and a nice to have. For example, I just received a stash of games from my parents that was in their house, several PS1 and PS2 classic. I want to play them since my Fat PS3 no longer works. I have found several replacements and even replacements parts but if the PS5 has BC from PS1 to PS4...no need.

[Razzer]

That isn't just Sony. There was barely a peep from folks about BC on Xbox One until MS revealed it out of the blue. I will say there has been a bit more angst about Nintendo's refusal to bring the virtual console forward to Switch than just about anything else. But obviously BC is really most important at launch. Two or three years after and folks have largely moved on.

[gangsta_red]

"There was barely a peep from folks about BC on Xbox One until MS revealed it out of the blue."

That's not true at all. On the Xbox forums, after the Xbox One was revealed, the top requested feature was backwards compatibility with the 360.

[rainslacker]

It's funny how this same tired argument gets regurgitated every time something comes out which supports the idea that maybe something will happen. What's funny about it is that it tends to make people seem like They don't really listen to what's been said, because it's not a flip flop, it's more people pointing out it's not that big of a deal,which it is made to be by those who want this not to happen because they care more about the console war.

But I haven't seen anyone actually say they don't want the feature, just that it isn't that important in the grand scheme of things. Since that's still.true, i.question what your going on about.

[starchild]

Well it is important to me and a lot of other PS4 owners who I've heard express wishes for it. It's up there with any of the main things I look for in a platform. I sincerely hope Sony will make the PS5 backwards compatible.

But why would Sony bother with something that isn't that important? Even there you're trying to downplay it. I understand why some of you downplay it for console war reasons, but I think it's terrible because I feel like you're undermining all normal PS4 owners that do want it. I hope to hell Sony hasn't been misled into believing that most PS4 owners don't want backwards compatibility in the PS5.

[Max_Eckhardt]

I hope the PS5 can not only play PS4 games, but also PS3,2, and 1 games as well.

[Max_Eckhardt]

I hope Sony have TRUE backwards compatibility and not the LIMITED emulation that the Xbox has.
I have to go to PC in order to play all of my games. Many of my favourites from the xbox 360 and Original Xbox are not available on Xbox One.

[gamer7804]

Microsoft has to get the rights from the publisher of the game, and the emulation actually let's the console run games better with more af so u act like emulation is a bad thing when its a bonus, the hold up with some games is with the publishing rights holder

[SquillieDeeWilliams]

You say limited like there's not a lot of games on BC. There are a TON of great games that are BC on XB1 and most of the highly requested games have been added already, plus they are continually working on bringing as much of the Xbox catalogue as they legally can. I don't think it is THAT limited.

[mkis007]

As bad as it is sometimes I just want to fly around in superman returns...

[Pantz]

Hope it's true. At the minimum for PS4 games. If they have enhancements via hardware that will be great. PS1, PS2, PS3 games are less likely but I really wish they would.

[Imortus_san]

hahahaha, Year after Year downplaying the Xbox retrocompatability, and now crying for the feature on PS5, LMAO.

[Elda]

There's a difference with the PS5 it'll be an added feature where with the X BC is it's first feature knowing it currently has no library of current interesting AAA exclusive games which has been that way for the past 2 1/2 years.

[Razzer]

Hmmmm....would that be kind of like generalizing Xbox fans who downplayed exclusive games and then saying they clamored for them when MS bought some studios? I mean....we are taking in terms about as broadly as possible so I guess we can just say whatever the hell we want and have a good laugh, right? You tell me. You have a better understanding of how this is supposed to work.

[Imortus_san]

Retrocompatibility is a feature that hits hundreds of games or thounsends if done properly, there are 500+ retro games games on Xbox One, and they all improve uppon the original, it's like free remasters, and it's a fantastic job well done, a pity it aint got all the xbox 360 titles (2000++ and those 3400+ self published).

I will welcome the PS5 retrocompatibility with open arms if it makes PS4 games run better then a PS4 Pro (since I only have a normal PS4 first release), just like the Xbox One X runs Xbox 360 games, it will make me buy some more games.

I haven't been here bitching about PS4 exclusives, I played a couple of them not many, but then again I also played a couple of MS exclusives and not that many, as long as they keep pumping them out (Sony and MS), the more chances there are they make games that I want to play, it's a pity that there are not as many exclusives this Gen like last Gen, but then again, to me this as been the worst console Gen in gaming history.

[TheGamez100]

Ohhhhh boy. Loving all these next gen news and rumors.

[Tesal]

I hope so with at least PS4/PS2/PS1 games fully supporting every digital title " physical for PS4 as well"

and later on PS5 cycle they should start supporting at least first party titles that did not get a HD/RM etc treatments.

[Shakengandulf]

Would be perfectly happy if it didn't have BC, but.... would be incredible if it did.

[Relientk77]

Mark Cerny is the man. He worked wonders with the PS4 and now it's time to work his magic on PS5.

[BlaqMagiq1]

If it has full NATIVE BC with every single gen of PS that will be a HUGE step up for Sony and PS5.

[rainslacker]

Might as well throw in vita and psp as well😀. Why not since they threw all that vita stuff onto the dualshock.

Would be one he'll of an epic system. Plus it would like cause a surge in psp and vita digital.games.

I can dream.

[rashada07]

I think with the push for digital- you have to have BC on the system. Imagine if your steam library was essentially erased every time you upgraded your GPU or CPU. My phone can play games I bought back in 2008- no reason consoles can't or shouldn't do this at least going forward.

[Donnie81]

I doubt it will have backwards compatibility. You guys know it doesn’t bother Sony one bit to charge you to play the same game over and over again.

[rainslacker]

Pretty sure it might bother them that they can't sell.all those digital games on psn and take their 20% cut.

[Profchaos]

I think this is hinting towards PS3 emulation more than ps4 emulation since the amd cpu currently in the ps4

So we could finally see a legal emulation of PS3 games outside of psnow

[Ninjamonkey82]

Rumours will be going wild till Ps5 reveal tbh i'm not gonna get hyped till the official reveal. This would be a nice feature but we know nothing till sony says so. I preFer it that way.

[Good-Smurf]

Mark Cerny is a Cold Blooded Genius guy.
I could listen to him talk all day.

[rlow1]

Of course they're going to do this. I won't be surprised at all when they announce it. They have a huge successful library on the PS4 and would only hurt themselves by not allowing the fan base to use their games on the PS5.

[OffRoadKing]

If this finally ends all the BS fake outrage articles then that will be its greatest benefit.

[sprinterboy]

Mark cerny, yes I can now sleep at night.

[Fluttershy77]

Mark Cerny = genius. He's the reason behind Sony's success.

[DrumBeat]

This must happen.

[sampsonon]

let's hope they don't go the way of MS and replace good AAA games with backwards thinking.
as long as they keep the new games coming and don't rely on past games to make a splash I'm all for it.

[wonderfulmonkeyman]

I hope so; that's part of the reason why I didn't get a ps4 day 1, so this would make me want a ps5 sooner if it supports all ps4 games.

[Imalwaysright]

Fingers crossed.

[Elda]

Fabulous if true!!!

[ANIALATOR136]

Glad to see Cerny is working on the next PlayStation again

[cliveo32]

It will support it no question ...

[JEECE]

Even as a person who thinks the importance of BC gets overblown, if sony came out and announced that you could put any PlayStation disc in your ps5 and it would play, that would be huge. People could say "well that wouldn't make them money," which may be true in one sense, but it would establish a ton of goodwill and probably would be worth it long term. A digital service, such as psnow, which had games from ps1-4 for download, would also be good move.

[starchild]

So it's overblown when other platforms have it, but it would be "huge" if the PS5 gets it? That's a non sequitur. The PC can play decades worth of games. That's no big deal, right? Not important. But if the PS5 does it... that's HUGE!

[JEECE]

1. There are no "generations" on PC, so there is no BC there. But obviously the ability to maintain a consistent library is cool.
2. When I say something is overblown, I mean people act like it is more important than it actually is. That doesn't mean it isn't important in the abstract.

[Harkins1721]

Hope they still uprez and add trophies to ps1 and ps2 games

[Starman69]

I just don't care about bc... I bought a ps4 to play this gen games, heck, I even bought a pro!!

[Skankinruby]

As long as it's not prioritized over anything else this is fine. Being able to download my ps3 and ps4 digital library on ps5 would be pretty cool, although if they released remasters of games I love I'd still buy them again anyways for the trophies alone

[Tross]

Well, there’s no spinning this. Good job Sony and Nintendo!

[Doge]

Would be cool if it’s PS4 BC if it means Pro level rendering without the horrendous fan noise. I don’t care anymore if it’s PS1/PS2/PS3 since I’d rather play them on their original hardware instead of software emulation.

Framemeisters and OSSCs are a godsend.

[gangsta_red]

I don't see how this is even a thing. The PS5 should be able to run PS4 games unless it's using an entirely different type of architecture that would make a new patent for BC impressive.

But I would like to see PS3 games made available to play on the next PS5. Imagine having the ultimate PlayStation that could play PSx to PS5 games all on one console.

Good thing Mark Cerny is inventing BC!

[rainslacker]

This seems more like it's for older hardware. Unless there was some weird set up with their next x86 processor, which wouldn't make sense since the x86 is already bc with itself. On the gpu side, the same system calls are still there.

There may be timing issues with faster processors, but that would imply Sony is using a much different bus architecture, which it doesn't appear that it is.

Then of course, this may just be a patent which never gets used, and may not apply to the ps5 at all.

Time will tell I guess.

[SegaSaturn669]

Guy should just change his fukn name to Mark Sony. Love him.

[shinoff2183]

Heres hoping, Id like ps5 to be BC with everything but Id be alright if ps3 wasnt on it. I understand the ps3 was a completely different then other playstations.

[Tesal]

About the PS3, Sony could show faith/goodwell by making an emulation for PS3 titles on PS5 and they bring every games own by Sony to it. Then they encourage other developers/publishers.

[Thundercat77]

The Playstation nation is at celebration with this allegations.

[Kiwi66]

At least there's one Sony executive who thinks that BC is a worthwhile feature unlike that other one who said it was something that barely anyone used

[Tesal]

Not only just that

But some of them at Sony said Backward was not needed/soughted for etc ... Yes, they introduced PSnow after it =/ showing disrespect 'n throwing some lies at the faces of some players who seeks emulated backward support and reusing at least digital content that already owned

[IRetrouk]

https://www.polygon.com/201...

[kevnb]

If they dont I wont buy a ps5.

[UltimateRacer]

This will be fantastic, I hope they do it. Imagine if we could play Uncharted 4 at 4K 60fps on PS5 or GTSports, GOW,Detroit.

[starchild]

Exactly. That would be awesome. Backwards Compatibility isn't just about being able to continue to play your game library without keeping old hardware, it's also about being able to enjoy those games at all new levels of quality.

[Moe-Gunz]

Mark Cerny is the GOAT

[Sophisticated_Chap]

If Mark cerney invents PS3 back compat, I'm all in.

[WickedLester]

Guys, I'm a PlayStation fan through and through. But I'm going to tell you something that many of you aren't going to want to hear, and I'm sure the dislikes will come like a plague of locusts LOL!

First of all, native PS4 backwards compatibility on PS5 is going to be a given with both physical and digital titles. This WILL happen and these patents have absolutely nothing to do with that. There's no technical "wizardry" that needs to be implemented for PS4 BC on PS5. The architecture will allow for it to happen.

Regarding any other legacy systems older than PS4, if you think this patent is in any way going to be applied to PS5 in order to allow you to play your existing disc-based PS1, PS2, and PS3 libraries you are in for some serious disappointment. This patent is designed for the sole purpose to re sell you those legacy titles digitally through the PS Store and to expand the existing library of available titles for PS Now subscribers in an effort to better compete with Game Pass. Sony is not going to put the time and R&D cost into such a feature on PS5 without finding ways to monetize it.

The cold hard reality is, those of you sitting on massive PS1, PS2, and PS3 libraries, you are in a relatively small group and for the vast majority who don't have libraries of older games, Sony would rather sell them legacy games digitally through the PS Store and keep 100% of the earnings, rather than to see those consumers buy used legacy games on disc where Sony wouldn't see a penny from those purchases

[Mithan]

What they are trying to do is make it similar to Android/IOS/Windows, in which the OS from PS4 evolves into the PS5, allowing for older programs to continue to run, as the older libraries and such, would still be available. The PS4 Pro actually helped them set the ground work for this and the PS5 will simply be an evolved X86/X64 AMD CPU core probably based on Zen, with an evolved AMD GCN Gpu, so all of this is 100% possible.

This is good, and something that needs to happen. I will purchase a PS5 on Day 1, however I will retire my PS4 Pro on the same day if I am able too, just because I do not want old consoles sitting around.

It was sad to me that the PS4 didn't support PS3 games except through PS Now, and many people will say "well just keep the PS3 around". No, I do not want to keep my old original "60GB" PS3 around, its huge and my entertainment center has limited space, yet I wanted to play some old PS3 games (Resistance series is AWESOME) and I never do for the simple fact that the PS3 in a storage box 20 feet up in the garage.

Not having this feature is obviously not a deal breaker for most gamers, but it sure as hell is a nice quality of life feature for everybody.

This isn't rocket science and I think it is something that is 100% expected from all gamers now.

Most of all, there is NO REASON to not give it to us. Period.

[blackblades]

I'll probably keep my pro just incase but trade the og since its just sitting in the closet.

[OpenGL]

This is an interesting development that will help guarantee a huge number of PS4 owners move over to PS5.

[mandingo]

Well if there’s one good thing Xbox has done this gen it’s BC. Glad Sony is following suit

[Yourworld]

In absolute positive news.

Seriously this is fantastic. As long as they aren't trying to patent the idea of an emulator (it sounds like just a specific technique because otherwise prior art), and just focused on how they can make BC for the Ps5, this is great news for Sony, the companies and the industry.

Only questions will they allow discs and personally I think they'd have to otherwise this will be dumb. Still good news all around.

[whitesky]

Mark Cerny is gonna become legendary like Kutaragi and Kaz Hirai

[DillyDilly]

I'd guy the guy that handled BC for Microsoft will always be bigger than Mark since they did it first & the best possible way

[Greedsin]

Funny how Sony said it's a feature everyone wanted but would never use, but now with Microsoft making it one of the bigger parts of Xbox One and for the next Xbox Sony wants to jump on board. This and only nit picking what games can go cross play is just showing that Sony kind of sucks at giving what people want in a console outside of their exclusives.

With all that said tho, I hope this is true and there is some sort of BC for the PS5. It will most likely just be PS4 games and not much else, but at the least its something.

[Knightofelemia]

This would be awesome

[DillyDilly]

I'll take Backwards Compatibility over Cross Play if I had to choose

[PCgamer98]

Nice! So it means I can sell my ps4.

[EpicFruityPie]

I'm not bothered when i upgrade it will be to play new titles not play everything i just played last gen and if i wanted to that bad ill just change the channel and turn on my ps4
I really have no clue why BC is so wanted

[RCslayer]

Never I repeat NEVER going to happen. You guys honestly think Sony is just going to give up on PS now, they make millions each year off of it. Fools support it and then expect for sony to have BWC. Not going to happen. End of story.

[QuePasa87]

This would be fantastic

[NotanotherReboot]

And now BC is suddenly cool again

[pozyczam]

What about number of hints?

[tonyjames404]

Very Interesting... ABOUT DARN TIME

https://cogpoweruppodcast.p...

[TheHan]

Lmfao PS playing catch up with Xbox’s BC. Only took them about 4-5 years to do so.